Response

Re: Any Advice On 40MHZ!

Thanks Mouldbuilder, I have s coming in my delivery! As I was told they are needed! I can do a signal check. Here at home as I have a very long hallway! It's over 100 feet long! Cheers, Ed

4 years ago by figtree7nts

Forum

Electronic Speed Controllers

"Can I wire two brushed 360 motors into one ESC" Yes you can Peter, That's what I did with my U25. My motors are 385s. The blue thing stuck to the starboard hull side, with two little white trim pots on it, is the ESC. The board bolted to the engine room forward bulkhead is the power distribution board to the motors and includes the spark s. Cheers, Doug 😎

5 years ago by RNinMunich

Forum

Fishtailing

Hi Martin years ago we used s on the ign coil of the car to stop interference to the car radio, and these were always connected to earth same idea on your model motor. Also some used to have a small brass chain dangling from rear of car body to the ground .Same principal as the prop shaft in the water dissipates all static to earth.

5 years ago by Elsrickle

Response

Re: Stern Module assembly

Hi Pete, "I have now purchased my chosen motors. They are MFA 360. ... I wonder if I have to put the usual three s on the motors if running a 40Mhz transmitter." Most definitely!! Considering the attenuation of RF signals under water the last thing you want to do is take risks with interference😮 As the RF signal level falls off when you dive the boat any local interference, i.e. from the motors, will become more significant at the RX input. Re warped stern parts. You could try gently (and I mean gently Bentley!) warming the part (hair dryer?) while weighting it down on a flat surface. You may want to put some shaped wood block supports inside to ensure the part does not bend inwards. Cheers, Doug 😎

5 years ago by RNinMunich

Blog

Stern Module assembly

This weekend I decided to do more work on the Gato Submarine. Now I am starting to realise how big this job to build the model is, let alone the WTC which I am thinking about and starting to plan in tandem. I have been working on the stern module today trying to get the rudder and aft planes in a working state. I have followed the video made by a kind soul on the internet which I am finding very helpful. To make them fit properly has resulted in a lot of filing and reshaping particularly on the rudder. All of the edges were interfering all over. After a considerable amount of adjusting, they now fit and work perfectly. A hole was carefully drilled right through the height of the rudder to allow for a shaft to be inserted for operation. Small holes were also drilled through some waste material to produce two running bearings for the rudder shaft. There has had to be a considerable amount of material removal inside the stern module halves to allow for the planes and rudder to work. This was done using a burr in the Dremel and files. Great care was taken not to remove too much and go right through the part. I am having a little problem with warpage of one of the stern halves. You can see the gap between the parts in one of the photographs. It might be that they will glue together without incident if I fix them well with bands during curing. Does anybody have a cunning plan to straighten this part before gluing? I have purchased the propeller shafts and tubes so further work on this module will continue when they arrive, probably towards the end of July. I have now purchased my chosen motors. They are MFA 360. I have also ordered the raw materials to make the motor mount and servo trays. I wonder if I have to put the usual three s on the motors if running a 40Mhz transmitter. Next time I am going to work on the bow planes. I will have them working and retracting. I bought the gears for the retracting mechanism today but have found them to be too big on diameter to fit two side by side in the bow module. The gears are perfect in every other way so I think I will reduce them to quadrants which should fit nicely. More cad design work for me I think.

5 years ago by MouldBuilder

Blog

Fitting shafts and motors

I have spent the last couple of sessions preparing and fitting the prop shafts, mounts and pump plate. First was to prepare the wood profiles, paint with sanding sealer and then prime them. They look a lot neater sprayed grey than just plain ply wood. I checked the two motors and found that the was not of the correct value. I removed it and replaced with the normal 47nf capacitor across the terminals and 10nf from each terminal to the casing. I then connected the wires to the terminals. I built the assemblies, fitted the motors and placed then in the hull. I then inserted the shafts and connected them to the motors via solid connectors. I prefer solid drive connectors where possible as I believe this should reduce vibration which is often introduced through universal joints. When I was happy with the alignment, I glued the shafts in place with Acrylate. I then fitted and glued the water intake pipe also with Acrylate. Next came the pump plate. This plate also has the rudder servo secured to it. After assembly, this was also glued to the hull. Next job was to fit the rear deck support and the bead on the outside which will eventually hold the rubber fender strip. The pencil taped to the flat stick at a distance of 12mm was used to mark the outside of the hull similar to marking the deck support line before. It was now time to prepare the two deck levels. Strengthening braces of ply wood were fitted all around. This has resulted in quite a strong unit. The instructions say that the fitting of the decks is next. I think they have forgotten all of the working features of this build. If the decks are glued now, there is no room for fitting in all of the gadgets. I will wait until I know what is required. Next time I will start the preparation of the cabin. This part contains most of the fire monitor servos and piping, radar and search lights plus general lighting. Very busy.

5 years ago by MouldBuilder

Forum

Motor suppression

Thanks Martin. I have seen this and it seems to be generally a standard layout. My main problem is whether the capacitor already fitted by Krick is adequate as the positive to negative contact is usually 47nf but the ones fitted by Krick seem to be only 1nf.😊 Peter.

5 years ago by MouldBuilder

Response

Re: Maxton modified wooden ornament

Hi! Doug no the esc is not home brew, it was from ebay. "RC ESC 20A Brush Motor Speed Controller w/ Brake for RC Car Boat Tank" for £3.37 works well and as far as the interference suppression with capacitors; no I don't find any need for them now I'm on 2.4ghz. All my models work from the one 6 channel transmitter, and none of them have any s on, although they are all brushed motors. Never had any problems. I don't do submarines so have no need for 40Mhz or 27 Mhz. I like to keep things simple!

5 years ago by MAXTON

Forum

Motor suppression

Hi guys, after reading all your advice including muddy's pm. I've fitted the s and earthed the motor can to shaft tube, then run the motor for 6 hours starting on 1.5 volts And working up by 1.5 volts every 20 minutes, plus running in reverse at each voltage step. Finally up to 12volts. No arcing and no interference. But while doing this I found another problem, the prop shaft was bent, it took about half an hour to true it up, now super quiet. I used Mitchell Marine Grease in the shaft tube. (Available at all good fishing tackle shops). Tomorrow I will try to do a load test in water if my grandsons paddling pool will take it as I want to know the run time on my SLA and gell batteries. Well that's it for tonight I'm pooped. Good night. Colin.

7 years ago by Colin H

Forum

Motor suppression

Thanks guys, I will call at Maplins tomorrow and get the appropriate s. it's good to know that help is so close at hand. The Worcester Model Boat Club open day on Saturday will be the relaunch day, as she hasn't seen water for nearly 20 years. Can't test beforehand as won't fit in bath. Will post pictures when we get home. Best wishes to all, Colin.

7 years ago by Colin H

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Hi Dave, sensible answer 👍 A Footnote ? Sparks are essentially broadband but most of the energy is in the HF & VHF bands and tails off significantly above the UHF band >500MHz. However, since the energy is proportional to the arc current(spark) and this rises with the applied voltage causing it your comments re fast electrics using higher voltages is entirely relevant. Also any close neighbours still using 27, 35 or 40 Megs will not be too chuffed, especially the fliers 🤔 Cheers Doug 😎

7 years ago by RNinMunich

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Hi Very new to boat building and have started with the Krick Lisa M so far so good' but am now confused as to how to solder the s to the 400 motor. Any guidence would be much appreciated. the motor comes with three s and im unsure how/where to fit. the motor has one "teminal" Red all others are grey.

7 years ago by mikelin2

Forum

Soldering s to motor

This thread has been a great help! Thank you all. John.

7 years ago by John2

Forum

2 motors 1 esc

Take a look here! "Soldering s to motor" I do have a good description of the ratings and what to do take a look! Ed

7 years ago by figtree7nts

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Regarding brushless motors, you must not add any capacitors across any of the three connectors. The interference is caused by sparking between the commutator and brushes on a brushed motor, and brushless have neither. I would tend to agree with AlanP regarding lack of interference from un-filtered brushed motors when using 2.4Ghz. However if you are into fast electric then suppression is important as their motors can generate lots of RF noise and losing control of a fast craft is not to be recommended. Whatever RC system is being used all signal wires must be routed well away from any motor high current wires. It's good to see that we have members who have and share their knowledge and experiences. Dave

7 years ago by Dave M

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Hi Alan all posts are worth mentioning or how else would we all learn😁

7 years ago by georgeo5664

Forum

Soldering s to motor

All my boats are now on 2.4 Ghz, six of these have brushed motors, none have suppressers, no problems over the past 4 years. Just thought I would stick my oar in 😁 Alan

7 years ago by AlanP

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Thank you all for your help, pretty sure i will be back when i hit my next snag.

7 years ago by mikelin2

Forum

Soldering s to motor

of course it is Ed us model boaters would be lost without this website wouldn't we George

7 years ago by georgeo5664

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Hi George I'm know expert, but I try. And isn't the hobby about sharing and learning. Got to pass it on... Regards, Ed

7 years ago by figtree7nts

Forum

Soldering s to motor

figtree7nts wow that's a brilliant description so easy to follow i thank you. you just taught me some thing new never stop learning cheers. milklin2 you should have no problems with the step by step guide figtree7nts has provided you in this post

7 years ago by georgeo5664

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Hi Mikelin2 I must agree with Georgeo5664, follow his directions you can't go wrong. you must solder the capacitors like he has described. The capacitors will help with any interference made by the motor(S) Take your time and look at the picture. You need to use capacitors that are the right ratings. lets say 2 capacitor at 0.1uF and one at 0.047uF now slide the 0.047uF capacitor through both terminals on the motor, slide the ends of the 0.1uF capacitors onto the opposite end of the motor terminal. now solder the terminals with solder. Take the ends of both 0.1uF capacitors and solder them to the case of the motor. Make sure you grind down a bit of the case. so that when you solder the capacitors to the case they stick to the case. Don't forget to solder on the leads, that go to your motor(S). Now as to the question about do you need the capacitors I would use them know matter what, just in case. But I've been told that if your using a radio that's on 2.4Ghz, You don't need any capacitors... I hope this helps But, in the event that you still don't get it, I would try to become a member to one of the local RC model clubs near you. And see if someone can help you with your motor. NOTE: Please use this information for a Brushed motor Only!

7 years ago by figtree7nts

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Brill thanks a lot i now understand. 😜

7 years ago by mikelin2

Forum

Soldering s to motor

mike yes s are required it helps to cut down the interference from the tx 1 capacitor goes from + to casing 1 capacitor goes from - to casing and last one goes from the + to the - pins on the motor hope this helps

7 years ago by georgeo5664

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Ed many thanks, i must be a bit thick i still dont get it. i have enclosed a photo of motor any help would be appreciated. I would also ask are surppresors required at all. mike

7 years ago by mikelin2

Forum

Soldering s to motor

Hi Mikelin2 Take a look at the ALL THINGS RC area. then look in the (Motors) Suppression area, there you will see where to solder the s on to the motor. Hope this helps. Ed

7 years ago by figtree7nts

Forum

interference s on electric motoers

Dave, this exactly what I needed. Thank you Chris

8 years ago by octman

Forum

interference s on electric motoers

Although I am anything but new, I am new to model boats. Can someone let me know the correct size of the capacitors that need to be fitted to electric motors. I have been looking this up on on the web and am finding conflicting answers. Some sources even advise 2 different values on each motor, depending on where they are connected. I know that in these days of 2.4Ghz radios interference is not supposed to be much of a problem, but I would still like to know the answer. So Michael Faraday, where are you? Chris

8 years ago by octman

Forum

interference s on electric motoers

HI Chris Welcome to the site. I use 0.1mfd caps across the terminals and from each terminal to the metal case. I have used 0.022mfd across the terminals but the 0.1mfd work OK. Some motors have internal caps fitted, you can usually spot these through the case slots by the brushes. Adding more will increase the value and may make matters worse. The main culprits are the heavy current fast brushed motors but all brushed motors generate interference. Brushless motors do not and must not have capacitors added to their leads. Keep all dirty (high current) wiring well away from the aerial, rx and servos and try and route servo leads as far away as possible from the power (battery) wires. I usually route the different wires on opposite sides of the boat. 2.4Ghz is relatively interference free but high current dirty motors should be suppressed to prevent interference. The Rx might be 2.4Ghz but the electronics in the ESC are still susceptible to high levels of electronic noise so keep the wires well apart and fit caps. Our All Things RC section has some suggestions. dave

8 years ago by Dave M

Forum

2.4gig Radio and brushed motors???

I have a Planet 5 with brushed motors and the vessel works fine. Have also tried both with and without s, found no discernible difference in performance. Was somewhat wary of limited Planet 5 range, but as have found that is about as far as I can see anyway it works fine.

9 years ago by Rowen

Forum

2.4gig Radio and brushed motors???

HI Oldtimer This sounds like going for a long stand or 20' of shore line. Suppress your new motors as you would for 27meg, dont listen to the barrack room know alls. I use a cheap Radio link 6 channel and a Futaba T6j some of my boats have s some dont, no interferance at all Regards Mark

9 years ago by jarvo

Forum

ESC problems

Looking at the spec for the MFA 850 Torpedo the max current is quoted at 10.2 amps at 12v. Assuming you are using the two 6v batteries in series giving 12v then the ESC should be OK. Do you know the actual amps being drawn by your motor? Could be the prop is two big for the motor. IC props are usually too coarse a pitch for electric motors. if you can borrow a wattmeter you can check this at the bank with the prop in the water. I would check that the prop shaft and motor are aligned and that there is no stiffness in the propshaft. This is a common cause of heavy current. Brushed motors are good at generating electrical noise which will play havoc with your electronics. You need to fit capacitors: One across the motor terminals and another two from the motor case to each terminal. I use 0.1uF ceramic. The placing of the wiring in the boat should be such that the high current (dirty) wiring is as far away as possible from the signal wiring and aerial. The fact that your problem starts at high power throttle suggests sparking interference is causing the problem. The 2.4 Ghz will not be too affected but the ESC will be. Do make sure that your aerial is above the waterline in the model as 2.4Ghz will not pass through water. Hope this helps solve the problem. 😀

10 years ago by Dave M

Response

electrical control panel

I fit 3 s Dave, 1 across the motor terminals and then 1 each from the terminal to the motor case. it was what I was taught er, "many" yeras ago as an electrical apprentice. think its was "second edition" when I did mine [ha ha], whats it on now? 25th? Ive lost count

12 years ago by Gregg

Response

electrical control panel

HI Gregg Glad to hear it works OK. I did not mean to suggest it would not work or was untested. However as a general rule you should keep all dirty wiring (power and motor leads) and components well away from any signal or control wires. Many people reading your post may not have your knowledge or exactly the same set up. Just noticed you fit your motor s to the motor power wires. To be effective they need to be soldered to the motor connectors and case.

12 years ago by Dave M

Response

electrical control panel

Well spotted dave !, sorry I did forget to mention, but "thought/presumed" that everyone uses s on their motors and solders these to the power wirs to the motor, prior to installation [if not already fitted of course]. The other item I did do, before sliding the electrical panel in, was to stick some alloy foil on the underside to act as a shield. The reciever sits above all of this, attached to one of the deck cross beams, so well above anything and also above the waterline too!

12 years ago by Gregg

Forum

34'' Fireboat

Dave, I will try to get that motor and battery set-up hopefully thro' Howes models as they are quite helpful -although their website shows that motor as out of stock. Did you fit s to the motor - did they come with the motor? I am more comfortable with the set up you have, weight of the Lead cell always suprised me especially being located so far forward on the boat. Pete.

13 years ago by PeteG