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>> Home > Tags > brushless

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Hull Pt2: Motorisation - Come What May!! by RNinMunich Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 21 hours ago
As promised (or threatened?😁) stage two of the hull work and thoughts on motorisation. The hull was sprayed with two coats of grey primer/filler. Pic1. As usual this showed up the remaining imperfections (pics 2 & 3), but I'm not going to worry about them until I've got prop shaft tube and rudder stock sorted out and permanently fitted 😉 After my attempts to make and thread a 3mm prop shaft went awry Martin (Westway the Mechanicals Master👍) stepped in and made me a decent one complete with a bushed stuffing tube 👍 Vielen Dank Meister😊 I did however manage to make a 4mm to 3mm reducer so that I could fit a Rabeosch 35mm prop as seen in pics 2 & 3. The tube and shaft from Martin, arrived Saturday an' he only made it on Monday😊, have been dry fitted so that I can start setting up the gears, necessary to bring the drive down to the prop shaft fitted very low down in the hull, and motor mount. Pic 4. Motorisation: (Remember folks - this kit was designed and built as a static model!) I want to use the old 1950s Taycol Target motor which my Dad originally fitted in the Sea Scout which I have renovated and upgraded to brushless. See Build blog 'Sea Scout - Jessica' Many of you will know that the Taycol motors were field coil motors, meaning that they have no permanent magnet around the rotor coil, and thus reversing the battery connections to the brushes had no effect on the direction of rotation, as this simply reversed the magnetic fields of both stator and rotor coils🤔 To counteract this so that the motor could be used in both forward and reverse with a conventional brushed ESC I modified the motor slightly (separated the two coils) and built a simple converter board to connect it to the ESC. Again see the Sea Scout blog for the details of the conversion. Basically; once the field coil and brush-gear (rotor coil) have been separated a simple diode bridge can be used to apply the output of the ESC to the motor. This enables the reversal of EITHER field OR rotor coil polarity, depending on how you connect the converter to the motor. Thus reversing the direction of rotation of the motor. Beneficial side effect is that the diodes also suppress the commutator sparking😊 In my case, with the Taycol Target, I also cleaned, flattened and polished the commutator. Thus significantly reducing the potential for spark generation in the first place! A peculiarity of the Taycol motors is that they all use metal brushes, pressed phosphor bronze strip, so they need oiling! DO NOT oil conventional brushed motors with carbon brushes unless the brushes are exchangeable or you want to have to buy a new motor!!!!! Pics 5 & 6 show the proposed position of the Taycol in Gina 2 and pic 7 the prototype converter board I knocked up to test the motor, together with a Graupner Navy V30R Marine Brushed ESC. Details and results in the Sea Scout blog, including video of the sparks and oscilloscope pics of the drive waveforms before and after conversion! The latter showing the spark suppression effect of the converter😊 Some samples attached - last 3 pics. Pic 8 pic shows a more compact version of the converter, one of a few types I'm doing for Martin's various Taycols as a trade for the prop shaft he made for me and some useful material he sent. Thanks mate👍 Next steps will be 1) mounting the gears correctly on the shafts, requiring the manufacture of a 3/32" to 4mm adaptor and a 1/8" to 4mm adaptor, and keying them to the shafts - Hooray for mini milling machines 😉 2) manufacturing bushed end plates to hold the gears in place, 3) fitting the motor mounting platform. I'll probably borrow from my experiences of real shipbuilding and do this as a suspended 'false floor', i.e. mounted on stiff springs to enable adjustments to optimise the gearing mesh! On real naval ships this is done to improve shock resistance and to minimise engine noise / vibration conduction to the hull, thus significantly reducing the acoustic signature of the ship. Not that I'm tooo worried about being torpedoed 😁 Worth a try😉 Pic 9 shows the cleaned up and renovated Taycol Target motor. Pic 10 shows the drive waveform complete with sparks before modification.🤔 Pic 11 the cleaned 'forward' waveform with the converter board. Pic 12 the cleaned 'reverse' waveform, no suppression capacitors needed 😉 More soon folks, Cheers, Doug 😎 PS Along the way a new keel was fitted as can be seen in pics 1 to 3. The original builder had 'buried' the keel in the hull planking! 😲

BRAVE BORDERER by RNinMunich Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 4 days ago
Bon chance mon ami👍 Don't know what TX you have but you may be able to do the mixing there. If not there are several separate mixer boards on the market. This one for instance; Action Electronics P40D from Component Shop. It's good for both brushed and brushless motors😊 See pdf data sheet. Mode 1 might be good for Brave Borderer!? http://www.action-electronics.co.uk/Mixers.html https://www.componentshop.co.uk/p40e-marine-motor-mixer.html Have fun, cheers, Doug 😎

Longer run time by Haverlock Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 6 days ago
Your question does not have simple answers have you used a watt meter to see the current your motor is drawing at full throttle? With any installation its a good idea to do that test since its a good way to match motor and prop. LiPo batteries have a better current delivery than lead acid BUT you do need to be careful about end voltages so as not to damage the battery. Many ESC have a voltage cut off built in to protect LiPo batteries it may be your hitting that limit with your lead acid battery. The simplest solution to your problem is to look at the Amp/hour rating of your existing battery and get something with a higher rating. Going LiPo can give a much higher rating with a LOT less weight. The downside being the need for a special charger and the need to be careful about storage and end point voltages. As to putting 2 batteries in series to get a higher voltage yes you can BUT increasing the voltage to a brushless motor requires you match the prop to the new voltage running on the existing prop will probably cook the motor. How hot is your brushless running now? Outrunners generally can swing a bigger prop than inrunners.

Longer run time by RNinMunich Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 7 days ago
Hi, Lead acid doesn't like delivering the high currents brushless motors want. They are more suited to long term low currents. Go for a LiPo, 3 or 4S, something 7AH plus should keep you going for a while. Don't put batteries in parallel as one will inevitably try to charge the other, unless you have a hi power diode board in between them to prevent that. Cheers, Doug 😎

Longer run time by randhbarker Sub-Lieutenant   Posted: 7 days ago
I am using 1 12v lead acid battery in my sea queen with a brushless motor. It’s only giving me about 15 minutes on the water. The boat will get up and go for a few minutes but after that I can have the throttle wide open but the speed has gone. Can I link more than 1 battery together to give me a greater voltage which I believe a brushless motor can cope with. If so which batteries should I use and should I wire in series or parallel? I await your thoughts Thanks

BRAVE BORDERER by RHBaker Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 8 days ago
Whilst waiting for the new motors and ESCs, reviewed videos of the vessel under power and noted that as the speed increases, the bow lifts towards a plane. However, as she gathers speed the transom flaps become effective, forcing the bow down in a cloud of spray. At this point the plane has been lost and the model becomes almost uncontrollable. Decided to temporarily ballast the hull to simulate the new motors and ESCs, then try to establish the optimum flap angle using just the centre propeller and shaft. This is the original 2838 brushless motor installation with a 30 mm propeller. With this simulated drivetrain it would also be an opportunity to determine the best battery locations for both 2 and 3S Li-Po batteries. Made up an angle template with a spirit level to get the correct deck inclination with the vessel floating at rest. From this located each type of battery statically - somewhere close to the mid-point of the hull. Which also seemed as good a place to start as any! Somewhere in the research for this model found a reference to the transom flap angle. This was at a 2 degree -ve (pointing downwards) angle. Installed the 2S battery and tried the model. The bow dug in at speed. Adjusted the flap to a straight and level position and tried again. The bow still wanted to dig in, but to a reduced extent. Readjusted the angle to 2 + ve and repeated. The bow now lifted so the forefoot just cleared the water and then remained in that position. Replaced the 2S battery with the 3S. The extra power obviously increased speed and the bow lifted slightly further. The spray was deflected by the chine rails and a level plane established. The conclusion is that the transom flap angle is critical to the correct planing of this model and that it should not be negative. Until the new motors and ESCs are fitted will leave the transom flap and battery locations as is. Once these components are installed, intend to repeat the test. Am confident that with some fine tuning the model can be now made to plane properly at a scale speed. Interesting to note that the model will just about plane with only one propeller operating – wonder what it will be like with all three?

Enterprise 6 by Kevin-56 Chief Petty Officer   Posted: 9 days ago
This was a scratch build from plans that I have had for along time. I have modified the plans to suite a boat similar to the Ocean Alexanda. She is 1380mm long and 310mm wide, driven by two 2150kv brushless moters. This boat took me 18 months to complete,and now is ready for her maiden voyage. Will let know how she performs.

Bow wave suppression by wunwinglo Lieutenant   Posted: 13 days ago
Hi Floating Voter, I do so agree that I should be flying, not ploughing. In fact, she does plane quite well, but she is 'dirty' at very high speeds.I am concerned that sooner or later, I will have electrical problems, despite trying to be careful not to overuse the throttle. She is fitted with 2 x JP EnErG brushless 600 O/R 1550 (C35 141), driving 38mm scale-type brass three bladers, contra-rotating. The pack is a 7.4 v, 30C lipo.

Seaplane Tender 360 by Westquay Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 15 days ago
The motor is the heart of the boat, which is effectively a hark back to a different time of modelmaking. If keeping the finish is important (and it is), then keeping the motor is too. If you want a brushless screamer, build a new one as representative of your modern era, leaving this current model as representative of an earlier one. Martin

Bow wave suppression by FloatingVoter Seaman   Posted: 16 days ago
Aren't you supposed to be riding over that bow wave not wallowing in it? If you have Lipo batteries you probably have brushless motors (kV? how many cells?) - try a smaller prop - much smaller - let the motors run free and show what they are capable of.

Charging NiMhs, one for Doug?... by Westquay Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 18 days ago
Right, gentlemen who know fings, here are shots of the wires I have. OK, I must have put the banana plugged wires in a box marked R/C Gear, I'm assuming, but the charger's wires mainly have brick red flat contact -containing plugs. However, none of my battery packs have those, they have the white things with two small round pins in 'em, one socket square, one round. The newest pack for binding duties has a little black jobby that fits the Rxs. Pictures included of all relevance. I tried to charge an old(ish) lead acid after making up a lead, but the charger put up a "Connection Break" legend on its screen. I assume that means, That one's f****d, mate. Fair enough, I thought it might be. But i still haven't worked out a lead to charge those green wrapped old NiMhs. I HAVE charged them before, because I have had two attempts at flying the aircraft. It went round in circles and then took a slate off my daughter's roof, proving that aircraft models really DO need insurance! Anyway, enclosed are three pics. The shot of a Lipo is to show that I do have such things, but that dates way back and although not damaged or bulged hasn't been charged while I've had it. It was sent to me with 2 small outrunner brushless jobbies and a couple of brushed ESCs as a thankyou for sending plywood to a part of Britain that the PO won't go to with biggish parcels. Finally....I have today received my FlySky RC set and guess what? It all works, perfectly, out of the box. It's PRE-BOUND! Whoopee do! It musdt be an upgrade as it came with a small Li-Po battery pack for the Tx. and a charge lead from USB to Tx. body. That's all great, but how do I know how long to charge it for? It currently has what looks like a full charge on it, judging by the brightness of the LEDs. Getting used to a passable impression of my son's old Subaru front wheel and tyre (complete with vented disc and caliper behind!) will take a while. I am guessing that pushing the throttle trigger forward is like a brake on a car. I assume on a boat it would be reverse? The instructions are not in any way exhaustive! But hey...on a tatty old Futaba servo it all worked a treat. Here's the pics of wires. Cheers, Martin

54 year old Crash Tender by RNinMunich Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 20 days ago
Hi Boaty, right on MOST counts👍 But some of us have 'The knowledge' 😉 Check out my 'Sea Scout Jessica - Renovation' build Blog. There's a section in it where I renovate the Taycol Target Dad put in the Sea Scout in the early sixties, with two wet cell lead-acid accumulators! I also converted it to run forwards and backwards with a normal brushed ESC. How is described in the Blog. A few pics attached, from dismantled to reassembled with new brushes. Pic 3 it the test set up with Servo tester to simulate RX, standard Graupner brushed ESC and my conversion board connected between ESC and motor. Then two pics of the input waveform to the motor; forward and then reverse. Last pic shows the 'unconverted' waveform, complete with whopping great sparks 😲 I've now upgraded the Sea Scout with a brushless and the Taycol will go into a Danish Fish Cutter I am currently renovating and converting from static to RC. The Taycol's sedate performance will be more suited to the cutter which only plodded along a 8 knots or so 😉 Complete process is described in the Blog. Otherwise you are right, with few exceptions the current young 'boaters' mostly belong to the 'instant fun chuck it when it stops working throw away' generation 🤔 Cheers, Doug 😎 Martin; for yonks I did my warships in RAF light camouflage grey which mysteriously used to turn up in Dad's office in the Electronics Bay, of which Dad was the CO. 😉 A bright yellow for my scooter also appeared one time!

Brushless motor selection by ARTH Apprentice   Posted: 24 days ago
MY #1 CHOICE WOULD BE A NEU MOTOR . NEU MOTORS ARE A BIT COSTLY BUT HOLD A LOT OF RECORDS . LEOPARD MOTORS ARE NICE TOO .BOTH MOTORS HAVE WATER JACKETS FOR THEM . I PUT A NEW 1515 IN A 27" CATAMARAN RUNNING 4S AND GOT 68 MPH ON THE GPS. ALSO I HAVE AN OLD DUMAS SKI DADDLE 36" RUNNING A LEOPARD LBP3674 - 2650KV WITH 3S AND GET ABOUT 40 MPH . I AM NOW WORKING ON A 36" GENISIS CAT WITH TWO LEOPARDS . PERFORMANCE TO BE SEEN !!!! I HOPE THIS HELPS YOU OUT SOME .

17-28 Torbay Severn Lifeboat by Weedman Seaman   Posted: 24 days ago
Hi Donnieboy, Nice video. Given me inspiration to make some of my own, never really gave it a thought until now. Hi Lesfac, What you said is correct. If you are intending to race around as fast as you can, even entering races at meets within your Club, then brushless motors are the best. I myself use both types. Brushless for speed in my Offshore, Catamaran, Rigger and all Vee shaped hulls but in my Dumas American Beauty Mississippi River Towboat (Jesus, that's a mouthful)and Joffre Tyne Tug then I use standard motors because they are not designed to race around but plod along. I also have a Southampton Tug which together with the Joffre are and will be used for their intended purposes. I am right now waiting for anyone to give me some advice on how to dismatel the Southampton so I can upgrade the RC equipment together with the batteries. I will however continue to use standard motors all be it, of a higher power for a Tugs daily job.

Brushless motor selection by Haverlock Fleet Admiral!   Posted: 26 days ago
if you use a "y" lead to couple 2 ESCs ( or if you use 2 different channels) make sure you remove one of the red signal leads from the ESC that way you do not risk you receiver ( this presumes your ESC(s) have BEC)