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January 2019: 10 people December 2018: 6 people November 2018: 11 people October 2018: 9 people September 2018: 13 people August 2018: 5 people July 2018: 8 people June 2018: 8 people May 2018: 7 people April 2018: 23 people |
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131 Total Posts
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Liverpool Model Boat Club
Since: 17th Mar 2013 
Hoylake Model Boat Club
Since: 9th Feb 2014 
Runcorn Model Boat Club
Since: 5th Apr 2016 Harbour
Avanti
Type: Other
Deans Marine RTTL
Type: Other |
Admiral
86 points away from Fleet Admiral!
Points
914 Total Points
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United Kingdom
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Ron Great to hear about this. I had a Kingfisher in 1972, powered by a DC Sabre 1.49 marine diesel. The engine was mounted just aft of the windscreen and it needed a a lot of ballast . With such a small engine and the additional weight the performance was mediocre. Is this kit in production again? If it is I might build one . Maybe this time I will fit a brushless running on lipos . This will give the model the performance it deserves. Boaty😁
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Has anyone done any significant modifications to a Thunder Tiger Avanti fast electric? I have one and all I have done is to replace the nylon prop with a metal one thus there is very little increase in performance and the reason for doing this was due to the nylon prop throwing a blade after striking an underwater object. Prestwich Model Boats have a suitable replacement motor complete with a better ESC than the existing Ace one and their system can handle up to 4S Lipos instead of the stock set up of 3s . I have located a source of a 4S Lipo which length and width is same as my 3S one but the height is a little more and it will fit into the battery box. To trim it out properly I would have to add some ballast to the starboard side. Due to the electrics including the battery all being in a small watertight box at the stern there is not a great amount of scope for a lot of mods. Boaty😁
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Good to see other PPLs and former PPLs on the Model Boats website. I took mine at Liverpool Airport known now as JLA (John Lennon Airport) in June 1984 and completed it in January 85. Trained with Liverpool Flying School aka Keenair in Cherokee 140s and a PA 38 Tomahawk. Later I moved into Air Nova which was also a Liverpool club and the actor Lewis Collins was also a member of that Club. At the time I was a member of Merseyside IVC (Inter Varsity Club) thus had plenty of passengers. One of them was Victoria Field, my former psychology lecturer who later became famous as a psychologist and writer. Eventually Air Nova moved to Hawarden Airport near Chester but the Club folded shortly after. I then joined the in house Club based at the field and I ceased flying in November 2016. Best flights were going over Snowdon VFR and down the Dee Valley. I also flew over Colwyn Bay to have a look at the boating lake though I haven't sailed there. I also saw the lakes at Llandudno West Shore and LLanfairfechan. The latter I am considering for sailing my fast electrics. Downside to PPL flying was the crosswind component of the aircraft being 17 knots , At Hawarden there is only one runway the 04/22 and Liverpool the 09/27. I did have to cancel many times due to this. Thankfully sailing model boats is much more enjoyable as we don't have that many snags to deal with and if the motor stops we don't have to do an emergency landing.😎😁😁 Boaty
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Three weeks ago I got a Proboat Sonicwake deep V fast electric. This appears to be a replacement for their previous model Vorocity. Very interesting self righting method with a water tank on the port side, slots in the deck and a large exit point at the stern. Idea is that if it capsizes, water will enter through the slots and as it draws the boat under, the air trapped in the hull will self right it. If the boat is stationary in the water, it will list to port due to water entering through the stern outlet and when power is applied it will empty out. Bit scary to watch at first as I thought the boat was on its way to Davy Jones. I use waterproof marine clear tape to seal around the hatch ever time I use it. The quality of the hull raises a few concerns. This relates to its ABS construction as the vast majority of similar boats at that price are made of fibreglass which is much more rigid and would be more suitable for the high speeds. Makers claim it does 50 MPH plus on 6S lipos. The electrics however are excellent with the exception of the external quality of the Horizon Hobby STX2 TX which looks a bit "toyish". For myself, this is not relevant as I replace all my wheel TXs with the "stick type" and I found that the Futaba T2HR fulfils all requirements and worked well when I sailed the boat. I have not yet changed the stock prop for an Octura one, the latter works great on my Blackjack 29 with a noticeable increase in performance. The motor is a Dynamite Marine W.C brushless 1900 KV with a 120 amp W.C ESC . 😁😋 Boaty.
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Just had a new Proboat UL19 Hydroplane delivered. Has anyone had any experience with one. It says 4 to 6S lipo but it mentions not to run flat out all the time on 6S and advises to reduce power in the turn to save the electrics overheating. Never had this info with my Backjack 29 and new Sonic Wake as both don't overheat when at full throttle. For some reason the UL19 has a larger prop fitted than the two other boats and the Blackjack has an Octura prop which I got from Prestwich Model Boats and goes very well. The motor in the UL19 is the same as the one in the Blackjack. My theory is that as the UL19 is a hydroplane which when set up is heavier at the bow and will need an extra burst of power to get it up on the plane. Boaty😁
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Hi Westquay It sounds Doug has got it right. I only went over to brushless 3 years ago when I returned to fast electric. All my existing models at the time had brushed motors installed and I did become confused with the "new technology". Having three wires from the motor to the ESC was a bit difficult to comprehend but as the boat was an RTR it was helpful due to having an instruction manual with it. It just takes time and experience to get use to such changes but it will be right in the end. My only experience of a non starter was back in 1976, this being the only time I had a date with a married woman. I had a Lotus Elan then and there was no room in the back and it would have been a waste of time calling the AA to resolve it.😁😎 Boaty
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Just got a new Proboat Sonicwake .The e.s.c and brushless motor look very good but the STX2 TX appears to be a bit cheap . Not sailed it as yet but changed over to the Futaba T2HR system as I had already done on my Blackjack 29. I prefer the stick to the wheel and the Blackjack runs very well on the Futaba T2HR and has the steering adjuster on top right of the TX case. Has anyone else used the Futaba set in place of the one that comes with the boat.😁 Boaty
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Hi Doug Red primer certainly is porus and does need some protection when used on a wooden hull. The only exception to this is when the hull is plastic then plastic primer can be used. It adheres better than the standard primer and is readily available from the likes of Halfords etc. I have used this on my Italeri P.T 109 and is still good seven years on. Boaty😁
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Winter of 1967 / 1968 was a bad time for trawler losses. St Romanus, Kingston Peridot and Ross Cleveland went down. The St Romanus and Kingston Peridot were side haul boats and this made them unstable when taking in nets that were full. I don't know what type Ross Cleveland was but soon after we had lessons in school about the tragedies and our teacher explained how the later stern haul boats were much safer. Boaty😁
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The Veron F.P.B does appear to be a very rare model and I feel £300 would be a reasonable price especially when you take into consideration how much a modern day manufacturer would want. Just look at prices for Deans Marine models, mainly their Vosper M.T.B. which is a lot smaller. Also Veron kits seem to have been overlooked and the only model that is easy to obtain is the Slec version of their 26inch River Police Launch. Phil Smith was a great designer of boats and aircraft . I sold my Veron RTTL in the mid 1990s and my fleet today consists of one original Sea Commander, one 34 inch Crash Tender , both of which I restored, an Italeri PT109 and two RTR fast electrics. TOP TIP for anyone who buys your F.T.B- trace around the parts and use them to build the model while keeping the kit intact. I do this with my Keil Kraft control line aeroplanes. B😁😎oaty
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Is this an ASRL as Veron did a version approximately 28 inches in length and made out of balsa and ply. I do recall that they manufactured a bigger boat but do not know if it was an ASRL or Fast Patrol Boat. Though from what you describe it sounds like the latter. Boaty😊
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Martin, I am amazed at your knowledge and skills. I like your reference to the possibility that wake from the Dowty was the possible cause of Donald Campbell's crash. I had heard before about wake being a factor as he turned around after his first run without refuelling. This led to the theory that it could have been his own wake as the cause . So many theories about the crash and all are valid as it could have been a combination of many. Boaty😊
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Very true, there isint a lot of interest in speedboats today. I remember some great ones when I was a child in the late 1950s and early 60s. I once saw an Albatross on a lake in Scarborough that was towing a water skier in 1959. I believe that is was made of aluminium instead of wood but it did have an inboard engine. . Another one I remember was the Dowty Turbocraft powered by a water jet driven by an inboard petrol engine . This was on the Southport Marine lake in 1961 and attracted a lot of spectators. It is up to us as model makers to keep the memories alive by what we build and sail. Boaty😎
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Westquay- Where did you get that hull. It looks great. I also have a spare brushless plus esc from a recently deceased surface drive hydro and I do prefer the submerged drive like yours. I have been searching second hand shops, the local flea market and car boot sales but found nothing. Boaty😊
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HOW TO CALCULATE SCALE SPEED Such is the diversity in model boating with anything from a tug to fast service launches and hydroplanes there is always the issue of what is scale speed as we want our models to look right when on the water. This can be achieved by finding the square root of the scale multiplied by the speed of the full size craft. All you need is a pocket calculator and as an example I will use an M.T.B that is flat out at 40 knots. The boat is a 1/35 scale model. We start by dividing 1 by 35 which is .0285714 then press square root that shows up as .1690307 which when multiplied by 40 (speed of full size craft in knots) gives us 6.76 knots for the model. When calculating it in miles per hour the process is still the same. Boaty😁
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Building a scale plastic model like the Schnellboot does involve a lot of creativity and imagination mainly around how to convert it to a working model. Initial stage is how do you get the motors, radio e.s.c and batteries to fit in and to add to this which component of the superstructure is going to be removable for access to inside the hull. Further matters include access to the motor and other working parts should there ever be a failure and need to replace the faulty part. Desired outcome is that you manage it without causing any damage. Greatest reward is at the lakeside when onlookers admire your work of art and are even more surprised how well it sails. Boaty😎😁
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You're doing a grand job there. I admire your dedication as you are so thorough in getting it right. Keep up the good work and the finished product will be a credit to you. Its an inspiration for me which I will have in mind when I start my next project. Boaty😁😊
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It is correct that brushless motors don't modulate as smoothly as brushed. I have had the same problem but now I only use brushless on my fast electrics. 3s lipos do put out a lot of power and as Brave Borderer is a scale model it could be that the speed exceeds the limitations of the hull thus when running on 2s it is more stable. Boaty😋
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Hi Onetenor Fuji 15 was a good glow engine which I don't think it is manufactured any more. Aero version max B.H.P was just below .40 when tested. If it was in a model aircraft it would have been around .20 to .25 depending on prop size which was good then for a small capacity glowplug . Marine versions when on the water put out a little less and the water cooled jacket was never as efficient as the finned cylinder jacket of the aero version. My two Aerokits boats, the Sea Commander and the Crash Tender are powered by single Speed 600 motors running on either 8.4 or 9.6 volt Ni Mh batteries. Performance is equal to that of marine diesel power such as the 2.46 Ed Racer and D.C 2.46 Rapier, the latter I used to watch in the fast steering events in the early 1960s at Fleetwood and Coronation Park in Crosby just outside Liverpool. Taycol powered versions would be obviously slower due to the additional weight were far more reliable and you did not have to put up with injuries from excessive use of a starting cord with kids watching and "extracting the urine" shouting "why wont it go mister". Boaty
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Found on E Bay but sold in June of this year, a 42 inch kit of a Simplas Marine Construction Vosper M.T.B. It would appear that there are not many about now. I built one in 1972 and the kit contained a fibreglass hull with all fittings including the guns being in cast metal. Deck and superstructure were plywood and the boat was a model of an early Vosper as it had a very narrow beam and torpedo tubes were towards the stern. I fitted a DC Sabre 1.5cc diesel but had to add a lot of ballast which resulted in a sharp drop in performance. This was solved by replacing the Sabre with a Fuji 15 marine version glowplug engine . The boat was free running and as I was on an apprentice engineers pay and could not afford r.c.as I was having to support an ageing Mini. This was my transport from Ellesmere Port to the boating lake in New Brighton. If I had bought a Taycol Supermarine motor it would have solved all my problems as the battery would have been the ballast. Boaty 😁
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I had an MFA Spearfish in the mid 1990s and it was powered by an MFA Marlin or should I say underpowered. The Marlin was a good motor but was not really suitable for fast craft such as a powerboat or fast service launch like an M.T.B. I understand that MFA did an 850 which was for fast scale type models but in the end I put an Irvine 25 I.C in the Spearfish. At the time there was a motor called a Buhler which I think was Swiss . I used one😁 in my Perkassa running on nicads which performed very well. For the Aerokits P.T boat there are a lot of suitable brushless motors around and running on lipos will certainly give you all the speed you want.😁 Boaty
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[Score: 9/10] 29"/1200g Avanti Capable of 15mph and a runtime of 5mins Single Propellor (2 Blade X Type 35mm) Direct Drive to a OBL29/19-15M (2 Blade X Type) Powered by LiPoly (11.1v) 15Amp/h Batteries Controlled Through BLC-40M (25Amps) ESC - Comments: ARTR fast electric by Thunder Tiger. Deep vee powered by Ripper Brushless outrunner. Will reach 30mph+ when flat out. I replaced the radio that came with the boat with stick operated Futaba T2HR as I preferred "stick" to wheel for sailing fast boats. Initial problem was slight leak where stern tube passes through the transom but soon fixed it with epoxy. Electrics are in a box at the stern which is appears to be water resistant. Though not for a raw beginner, it is great for a second boat especially if someone is hoping to move on to a 6S . If not , it makes a good all rounder and is ideal for club fast electric racing and it performs well when doing tight turns. Boaty
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Interesting restoration project . Great fan of Taycols myself though its some 24 years since I had one. The motors themselves are bristling with character as you can see the armature rotating and you do get the smell of something electrical along with it. Taycols go further than being just power units as they are good ballast due to their weight. Unfortunately through progress they have been replaced by little tin cans and brushless devices. Hopefully someday a person or a company will put them back in production due to the number of retro boat kits now being sold. Boaty
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I bought an Italeri PT109 kit in 2011. It took 4 months to build as I had other projects on at the time. I notices the high quality of the parts, especially the hull and the actual paint finish was very easy due to it being plastic and got the nearest colour match by using Humbrol spray acrylic of Grass Green with Regency Red acrylic for the waterline and below. Difficult decision was as to build as a triple screw to maintain scale or go for the single screw. I eventually went for the latter with just one rudder. Power was by a 480 brushed flight motor with a 30 amp esc which was a bit over the top as power was by a 2200mAh 2S Lipo but the esc was the only one they had in the shop. Getting the motor installed was very straight forward as it was done before the deck was fitted but I had to make the aft cabin detachable for access to taking the battery in and out and also lubricating the propshaft .The boat performed well at scale speed but got slightly out of shape when full power was applied, appearing more as a fast electric. Overall the boat was ideal for smaller ponds (providing it was not running flat out). The outcome was a well detailed model that appeared like the real thing on the water but I would not recommend sailing it in rough conditions.. Boaty😁
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I had this situation on an old Aerokits Crash Tender that I restored. Though there was no motor with it and the hull was in a very poor state I noticed the stern tube was plain steel with no evidence of bearings though the prop shaft was a good fit. I got round this by lubricating the shaft with Marine Grease (Dynamite Marine) which is a blue grease that I use on my fast electrics. This can be purchased from Wheelspin Models. You can also purchase a grease gun from them which is very useful as you can fill the whole stern tube . On my fast electrics the flexi drive to the prop is in a nylon sleeve that is flexible but does not have bearings installed. As the brushless motor exceeds 22,000 rpm I can confirm that the grease does a good job as I have not had a failure with it. Boaty😁👍
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SLEC do have a good reputation and its great that the classic kits of old are back in production. The Sea Commander is one of my favourites as I restored one many years ago but foolishly sold it to fund my karting activities four years later. However in 2011 I found another one and restored that. This one I am keeping along with the 34 inch Crash Tender of 1962 vintage that I restored in 2014 being one that the former owner was about to place in a skip. I am interested in a Sea Rover as its a boat I never had. In the early 1960s when we lived in Liverpool, dad would take us up to Fleetwood to see the Aerokits display and watch the steering event on the big lake. Nostalgia aint what it used to be. Boaty😆
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Does anyone know what happened to the two Crash Tenders after they were sold in 1958? I have tried several avenues for exploring this but nothing had come to light as yet. Could it be that they might have been used as targets but this was never recorded? Boaty😁
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The Nor Star Kingfisher is a heavy boat for its size and the positioning of the motor and prop shaft angle certainly matter. I built one in 1972 powered by a DC Sabre marine diesel (1.5cc) and the engine was in the cockpit which made it heavy at the bow. I was disappointed by its poor performance in relation to other boats of similar dimensions, in some cases these being powered by 1 cc diesels. It never crossed my mind that I could have used "ballast" and the boat was sold on 7 months later at a greatly reduced price. "Fools rush in where experts fear to tread." Boaty😎
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Hi Mzee Re hovercraft, it may be worth looking at information around models by the late Ray Malmstrom. He was an ace when it came to designing unorthodox models and another source would be the Plans Handboook. I remember this in the mid 1960s and there was plenty to choose from as they had a special section on such. This included anything from hydroplanes, prop driven racing cars and hydrofoils etc. Another source could be the Eagle Annual from around the same period. Though the Eagle was a comic, the Annual did have articles around the latest technology of the day. Even if you could not obtain the Annual itself I am sure there would be archives on the Internet. Hope you have success with your venture, it sounds exciting. Boaty😁😎
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Thanks Westquay. I like your comments about air boats not being used much anyway. This is very true. Even if the boat was powered by an electric motor there would always be some miserable sod who would complain about the rotating airscrew. Boaty😁😎👍
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