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    Likes
    Graupner Bugsier
    by ianed57 πŸ‡¬πŸ‡§ ( Midshipman)
    13

















    Comments
    Boat Length
    35" (88.9 cm)
    Motor Type
    Brushed
    Drive Type
    Geared
    Props
    Single
    Battery Type
    Lead Acid
    Battery mAh
    4Ah (4,000 mAh)
    Prop Type
    3 Blade
    Prop Size
    50mm
    2 months ago
    Flag
    I bought this boat on Ebay a few years ago. She was in a fairly poor state but I did her up a bit, anglicising her in the process. I left the geared 540 in her which is still a bit noisy and fierce (the boat practically planes on full speed). I might change that for a low noise 540 if I can get the old one out without ripping out her bottom! The radio glitches like mad so I need to get to the bottom of that - I suspect it's the geared motor which needs suppressing. She'll be worth persisting with as she looks a treat in the sunshine.


    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by Ianh ( Chief Petty Officer 1st Class)
    Flag
    What type of Radio? If it is 40Mhz Suppression done properly could help but check the aerial on the receiver! If it is 2.4Ghz you shouldn't have glitches.
    Check to see if aerials are above the waterline as 2.4Ghz don't like being under the water line. Signal can't penetrate water. 40Mhz no Problem
    Good Luck!
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by Dibdawg ( Petty Officer 2nd Class)
    Flag
    Well it certainly looks good now!
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by ianed57 ( Midshipman)
    Flag
    Ian, yes it is 2.4 radio and I was confused, but it is quite serious. It is the only plastic hull I use at the moment but the rx is well up in the boat, ie above the waterline. It's on my to-do list, which about three yards long, and I shall probably go through the whole thing and replace the motor. All a bit academic at the moment!
    Thanks for the interest.
    Ian
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by ianed57 ( Midshipman)
    Flag
    Thanks Dibdawg, she is very pretty out on the water- when she behaves herself!
    Ian
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by Ianh ( Chief Petty Officer 1st Class)
    Flag
    You don't need to suppress the motor @2.4GHz😊😊 Make sure the aerial(s) are set up properlyπŸ‘πŸ‘
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by RNinMunich ( Fleet Admiral)
    Flag
    "You don't need to suppress the motor @2.4GHz😊"
    YES YOU DO!! (BOTH IANS!)
    Unless you are totally alone on the pond/lake.
    There are still a number of us who still use 40MHz.
    1. Cos the sets we have were not cheap! and they still work.
    2. Cos some of us run submarines, for which 2.4Gig is worse than useless.
    If you run an unsuppressed brushed motor near someone with a 40Meg setup and you cause a disaster then I just hope your insurance premiums are up to date.
    Maybe also your health insurance, depending on how many hours/years work and cash the claimant/injured party has put into his model.

    It's true that with 2.4Gig it's highly unlikely that an unsuppressed brushed motor will disturb your own model, but please remember you are not alone in the world!
    Doug, Disgruntled 'pig boat' driver.
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by Joe727 ( Lieutenant)
    Flag
    Doug,
    Very good of you to point this out. πŸ‘πŸ‘
    Joe
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by ianed57 ( Midshipman)
    Flag
    I have only run this boat a handful of times and never caused a problem- but as I said, I intend to work through it before running again, whenever that may be. Incidentally I have had to resort to wrapping a motor in tin foil even with suppression and 2.4 ghz.
    But certainly a useful point to remember.
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by RNinMunich ( Fleet Admiral)
    Flag
    "Very good of you to point this out."
    Not for the first time I'm afraid Joe!πŸ€”
    It's true that sparks from a brushed motor radiate most power in the LF/HF bands. 27Megs sets are even worse affected than 40Megs. And that the power density drops off rapidly from the VHF band upwards, so doesn't affect 2.4Gig RXs. Which has created the myth of 'You don't need suppression with 2.4GHz' ☹️

    What these guys also forget is that there are two kinds of Electromagnetic Interference (EMI) from brushed motors and the like. Radiated and conducted.
    It's the radiated (RFI) that directly affects other folks and their models, but the conducted, along signal and power cables can affect their own model.
    Typical mistake is running ESC and motor power leads alongside servo / ESC signal leads or even close to the antenna. In a worst case these leads (if they are unluckily roughly the right length, close to a harmonic or sub-harmonic wavelength) may also form an antenna and thus radiate to other nearby models☹️
    Capacitors on the motor and ferrite rings on the servo/ESC cables helps to suppress this.
    (Soap box now packed away for the night😁)
    Cheers, Doug 😎
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by RNinMunich ( Fleet Admiral)
    Flag
    "I have had to resort to wrapping a motor in tin foil even with suppression and 2.4 ghz."
    Wow! That's pretty extreme Ian!
    Were the brushes and/or commutator perhaps k-nackered?

    Always try to keep signal and antenna wires as far away as possible from power leads.

    BTW: Most 2.4Gig RXs come with two antenna wires sticking out.
    I've noticed that the installation instructions often just say 'arrange the two antennae at 90Β° to each other'. That's only half the story πŸ˜‰
    One should be vertical and the other horizontal to match the two antennae in the TX.
    A vertical 'rubber duck' and a horizontal wire in the handle of the TX.
    (May not apply to the cheapo trigger and wheel handsets favoured by car racers and crawlers, but then they don't need the range that we do.)
    Known as Polarisation Diversity to radio engineers. (Guess what I was for 40+ years😁)
    The RX then selects and uses the best (strongest) of the two received signals.

    Small tip bye the bye: for maximum signal strength at the RX, and hence best range, don't point the rubber duck antenna straight at the model. Hold it vertically as the max signal is radiated horizontally from the middle of the antennaπŸ‘
    The horizontal antenna in the handle works in either position cos it remains horizontal😊
    Happy boating folks.
    Cheers, Doug 😎
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by Ianh ( Chief Petty Officer 1st Class)
    Flag
    OK Fair Enough I always suppress my motors old habit! My father was a senior electronics engineer and he always said that suppression wasn't required on 2.4Ghz
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by ianed57 ( Midshipman)
    Flag
    I never actually said the motor in this boat wasn't suppressed-it is, but obviously not effectively enough. It'll be awhile before I get to doing anything about it now, and it's all fairly academic at the moment anyway! When I do, I shall replace the motor with a low drain 540 - suppressed!- and a 1:1 belt drive ( turned brass pulleys and O ring belt). I have found this set up works very well in other boats of similar size and weight.
    Stay safe and happy building all.

    Ian
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Graupner Bugsier
    1 month ago by roycv ( Able Seaman)
    Flag
    Hello I can only speak for 27 and 40 Mhtz but occasional glitches can be caused by not having the can of the motor de-coupled with a capacitor.
    They happen every few seconds as interruptions to the motor and I use the 0,1 micro farad ones used for de-coupling the brushes to get rid of them. You can use the prop shaft as an 'earth' in a plastic hull.
    I must get back to building my Bugsier 3 it has been years since i started.
    Roy
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