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    Coming about using a bowsprit.
    by Nerys πŸ‡¬πŸ‡§ ( Rear Admiral)
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    9 Posts 8 Replies 5 Photos 13 Likes
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    Nerys
    Rear Admiral
    πŸ“ Coming about using a bowsprit.
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    Country: πŸ‡¬πŸ‡§ United Kingdom
    Online: 2 hours ago
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    Ron, In my opinion, the rig you have doesn't look balanced with the hull. You might find she sails better without the staysail. Sailing to windward, she should, to be properly balanced carry slight weatherhelm, at the moment she is obviously carrying a lot of lee helm which stops her coming about. Ian has posted a lot of useful information, follow his advice and you should get a definite improvement in handling.

    Good luck, Nerys
    When the winds before the rain, soon you may make sail again, but when the rain's before the wind, tops'l sheets and halyards mind
    ianed57
    Sub-Lieutenant
    πŸ“ Coming about using a bowsprit.
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    Country: πŸ‡¬πŸ‡§ United Kingdom
    Online: 48 minutes ago
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    Ron,
    I agree with Nerys that the sail plan of your boat is basically in the wrong place and adding a bowsprit would make things worse. There is a lot of info out there about centre of lateral resistance and centre of effort of sail plans. I think, if you want to keep the mast where it is then you will need to build a new rig, as Nerys points out.
    There is no reason that Dragonforce rig shouldn't work if it was in the right position- it does look a bit odd though, probably a bit too high.
    I Googled 'calculating centre of effort of sail plans' and immediately found fairly reasonable diagrams and explanations and any book on yacht design will make it clear. There are also You Tube videos.
    I once read that experienced scale sail builders would mock up a rig with dowel, plastic bin liners and tape just to try a rig out before committing to spar and sail making.
    You need to know the clr of the hull and c of e of any proposed sail plan before making any educated guesses. You can find the clr of the hull by putting in the bath and pushing sideways with a digit, when it moves sideways without tipping one way ot the other, that's it. Or trace the underbody shape and cut out in card and balance on a knife edge - if you have the plan.
    The centre of effort of the sails should lead the clr to give a little weather helm.
    Good luck and have fun.
    Ian
    1
    Joe727
    Commander
    πŸ“ Coming about using a bowsprit.
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    The sails, mast and booms in the photo are from a Dragonforce 65. This is a very light, 65cm length, plastic boat that only weighs about 3lbs. This setup is far too light and small in area to propel that boat hull, at least that's my opinion.

    Look up the Dragonforce 65 and you will see what I mean.
    Joe
    1
    Ron
    Lieutenant Commander
    πŸ“ Coming about using a bowsprit.
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    Country: πŸ‡¨πŸ‡¦ Canada
    Online: 11 hours ago
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    I disagree.Here is the original sailboat I designed my model from. See where the mast is located? See the length of the boom? The mast has no noticeable rack aft.

    We cannot see the full mast though what can be seen should provide ample information as to how the model should be rigged.

    In talking with those who sail Nordic Folkboat designs, they come about very easily. When I did my tests the wind was barely noticeable. I will be doing further testing
    soon, now that there is a slight rake aft.

    This boat is not a true Nordic Folkboat. It is too short and fat. It is a European design which I am told there are many of the Folkboat style.
    Nerys
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    Ron, looking at your photos I would say that the centre of effort is far too forward. A real boat rigged like that would be carrying lee helm and would be difficult to get to come about. If she was mine, I'd give her a lower aspect mainsail, much longer on the foot than the sail you are using. I think the boom would need to end over the transom.

    Cheers, Nerys
    1
    When the winds before the rain, soon you may make sail again, but when the rain's before the wind, tops'l sheets and halyards mind
    Ron
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    Raking aft, eh...Like this?
    2
    Nerys
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    Just raking the mast aft a bit could help as well, easier than altering the position of the mast step.

    Cheers, Nerys
    2
    When the winds before the rain, soon you may make sail again, but when the rain's before the wind, tops'l sheets and halyards mind
    Ron
    Lieutenant Commander
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    Will try the easiest first of adding to the rudder. I had to do that on the Wianno Senior too.

    Thanks

    Ron
    3
    Nerys
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    Hi Ron,
    I do not think the addition of a bowsprit to your boat would help her come about, in fact it might make things worse. The problem is that the centre of effort of your sail plan is too far forward to drive her round and the fact that the deep keel comes well forward doesn't help either. If she was mine, I'd move the mast a bit further aft. A bigger rudder might help as well. Really it boils down to a full size boat design not always working on a model.

    Good luck, Nerys
    3
    When the winds before the rain, soon you may make sail again, but when the rain's before the wind, tops'l sheets and halyards mind



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