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    American Beauty Barge, Questions
    by bruce1946 πŸ‡ΊπŸ‡Έ ( Warrant Officer)
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    17 Posts 16 Replies 0 Photos 39 Likes
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    dave976
    Midshipman
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Country: πŸ‡¬πŸ‡§ United Kingdom
    Online: 10 hours ago
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    Hi Roy
    I have used milk bottles in my model barges, but really they are not carrying anything and you only see the sides not the bottoms so if you make a false bottom in side the hull you will reduce the displacement and hence need less ballast. For display you could fit a removeable bottom.

    This is of interest as my Olympic 1:96 requires 56kg of ballast. I have the hull for the Mauretania at 1:96 and am thinking I will do something similar. My large puffer has a tank open to the outside and I flood this to water level using a fish tank air tap to seal the tank. Using a large SLA 12v 12aHr battery causes the model to settle and removing and opening the tap lets it rise making recovery fairly easy as the water escapes thro the bottom.

    Could work with your barges as heavy models take ages and lots of power to move or stop. At full speed the Olympic takes 3 boat lengths (27 feet) at full speed to stop and not much less to respond to the rudder.

    I can sympathise with you sentiment about time available and other interests and models. Funnily enough I also have a 10th scale fishing boat to finish and I have not touched my model train for about four years now, but someday.

    regards
    Dave
    1
    roycv
    Chief Petty Officer 2nd Class
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Hi Dave I have 2 barges but it is all very bulky so probably 2 side by side. The problem, isn't there always a problem? Well it is the barges they have to float down to a comparable level with the towboat. This has just over an inch freeboard.

    I do nor want extra weight so they will probably flood down when in the water. The barges may weigh 40 pounds each easily when full of water.

    Even then it will be over 6 feet long and needs to have a quick assembly at the pond side. But the weight of water in the barges should introduce some interesting manoeuvring.
    All I have to do is to live long enough to finish it but as always there are other pressures as I want my model railway working before Christmas and there is a fishing boat to finish. Don't ask about the rest!
    regards
    Roy
    3
    dave976
    Midshipman
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Sounds fascinating. I have to ask, how many barges with loads are you planning? I will certainly have a look
    Dave
    1
    roycv
    Chief Petty Officer 2nd Class
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Hi Dave to answer your other question most of the Towboats have fixed korts and remember the power of the engines is enormous. American Beauty can be seen with 30+ barges in front.

    They have 2 rudders ahead of the fixed Kort and a single one behind. The controls are with large levers either side of a chair. Have a look at a day on a towboat on youtube.

    My guess is that the power needed to turn a Kort with thousands of horsepower on the propellor would not be economical.
    The towboats are very low in the water and they vary in size as to what job they do. Up to 6 barges can be attached with chains widthwise and perhaps 7 or 8 more in length. There is a video of American Heritage pushing 42 barges, a barge can take the equivalent of a thousand trucks!

    The A.B. is among the largest and then when the barges are separated for onward travel smaller towboats do that and you end up with the smallest towboat that shifts single barges around. Mainly grain and coal and iron ore and oil but others are fitted for containers etc.
    The Mississippi and Ohio rivers are a backbone of the US running from Minnisota down to the Gulf of Mexico The boats never stop except to load and discharge and the crews are ferried out to them, the journeys take many days night and day.
    Have a read it is fascinating!
    Regards
    Roy
    3
    roycv
    Chief Petty Officer 2nd Class
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Hi Dave give me time on this one, but the principle is to switch the rudder servo signal wire either between the receiver (for control) or the servo tester manually set to neutral.

    The switching is done by a 9gram servo with a microswitch connected via a Y connection to the esc servo. i.e. the 9 gram servo moves with the esc.

    So which ever direction the motor is going forward or reverse only the rudder in the prop wash will operate the other rudders being held in place by the servo tester control.

    So for a set of rudders they will either be connected to the receiver or a servo tester. Reversing the esc alters the servo driven microswitch and the other set of rudders are connected to the receiver and the previously moving ones now return to neutral.

    Ebay has the little blue servo testers at a couple of quid each and 9 gram servos at a Β£.
    I have tried it out and it works.
    regards
    Roy
    3
    dave976
    Midshipman
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Hi Roy
    Interesting set up. If I understand correctly you have two Props and each prop has three rudders both fore and aft. I have never seen a rudder placed ahead of a prop or Kortz. I always thought it was the propwash acting on the rudder that produced the sideways thrust.
    As you say anything in front of the prop will interfere with its operation if not in line.
    I agree that operating the rudders according to the direction of travel should work.

    It's possible that fixing the forrard rudders to straight ahead and linking the rear rudders would also work with independent motor control.

    I would be interested to see how you proposed system performs.

    What electronic system are you using for the control?

    regards
    Dave
    1
    roycv
    Chief Petty Officer 2nd Class
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Perhaps you would like a story connected to me receiving my birthday present of American Beauty.
    It was July 2001 and my son was holidaying in the Mississippi area and saw a large towboat for the first time and decided it would be a present for his dad!

    He went to a model shop and ordered the kit plus 2 barges to be sent low cost by container to the UK. (They group stuff together until it is viable to send)

    The kits arrived very quickly, I was surprised and checked the packaging. The cost was enormous over Β£200. Which was more than the kit cost at that time!

    The model shop had just sent it all by air instead of following the instructions.
    When I undid the packaging the kit was there plus another large kit for another boat, not the barges.

    I contacted my son who at the time lived in Germany and he contacted the model shop and they said sorry but..... I think they had a staff member who was not the brightest soul etc. They said send it back not offering to foot the cost!

    I said I would persue it this end and contacted the importers J Perkins I think. I spoke to a lady and she was very helpful and said she would sort it out as she was travelling to USA in that area as part of her business.
    Now you may wonder why I mentioned the dates? Well time was moving on the lady mentioned arrived in USA. It was now August and a day or so later 9/11 happened.
    So my kind lady was stranded in USA for a week, but during that time she arranged for 2 barge kits to come to me.
    When she arrived back I was asked where my local model shop was and 2 days later they phoned me saying they had a parcel for me.

    So the importers in the UK really stepped up to the plate and sorted out a difficult situation many thanks to them.
    The extra kit I sold at cost to a Magazine although I do not remember it being reviewed. My son got most of the postage money back from Barclaycard.
    All is well that ends well but it would kave been much better if the kit had been worth all that effort!

    Hope I have not bored you all.
    Roy
    3
    roycv
    Chief Petty Officer 2nd Class
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Hi Dave read your post with interest. The American Beauty has 3 rudders per prop, 6 in all. So you can treat each set of 3 rudders together or you can pair off the logical stern rudders. This leaves the other 4 rudders to work in pairs.

    Depending on boat direction there is a set of rudders in the way of the water to the Kort, so if they all work together there will always be a disturbance ahead of the water entering the nozzle.
    My idea was to use the direction of the motor to determine which set of rudders would be activated and return the other set to neutral. I have worked out the electronics to make this happen.

    Just need to finish the model!
    regards
    Roy
    4
    dave976
    Midshipman
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    If it gives you enjoyment and produces a good result then this is why most modellers build their creations. In this modern throw away world it will be those who possess the skills who will save our planet and modelling certainly develops those in abundance.
    2
    Newby7
    Vice Admiral
    πŸ“ American Beauty Barge, Questions
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    Country: πŸ‡¨πŸ‡¦ Canada
    Online: 31 minutes ago
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    I'm in the process of building my 4th Dumas kit (Lord Nelson Victory Tug). Each kit has issues and needs fine tuning to be built. In my mind I don't think Dumas kits work well for novice builders. My builds have and are turning out well and I like the finished boat.
    Rick
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