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    Thames Barge Celia Jane
    by wwfiets πŸ‡©πŸ‡ͺ ( Leading Seaman)
    15

















    Comments
    Boat Length
    47" (119.38 cm)
    1 month ago
    Flag
    Build from the drawings of David Metcalf. It is almost finished and I'm looking forward to get here sailing.
    Main sail, forsail, leeboards and rudder are controlled. A motor is as well on board.


    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    16 days ago by Nerys ( Admiral)
    Flag
    Hi Tom, thank you for mentioning the AMBO site again . My reference to it has probably been lost as I spoke about it in my first post on the subject. I quite agree, that is the place to go for any detailed information on model Thames Barges.

    Cheers, Nerys
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    17 days ago by tomarack ( Warrant Officer)
    Flag
    Hi, nice built model,
    I recommend you to visit AMBO link ,please -(Association of Model Barge Owners ) It is basically a replacement solution for older AMBO sites that have ceased activity . Here you will find further answers to your questions as well as a number of other documents for the construction of TS barges.
    >https://www.facebook.com/groups/2659272094133382
    Tom
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/2659272094133382
    πŸ”—
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    18 days ago by Nerys ( Admiral)
    Flag
    Excellent answer to the problem Jacko, as long as it is easy to do and if you don't mind swapping them round.

    Cheers, Nerys
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    19 days ago by jacko ( Sub-Lieutenant)
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    rudder i made with drop 1 for sail 1 for show
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    19 days ago by Nerys ( Admiral)
    Flag
    It has just come to me. Did your original plan show a rudder extension.? If not, I would strongly recommend that you fit one. The rudder on a model barge is not deep enough in the water to effectively steer. I always build a slot on one side of the rudder, then push an extension down through that. Others pivot an extension. I have seen a rudder built up of three layers, the middle layer being left out for an extension to be dropped down. Whichever you do,and it doesn't matter what, you need an extension of some sort.

    Cheers, Nerys
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    22 days ago by Nerys ( Admiral)
    Flag
    I'm sorry, I missed your question about the Forestay. That comes down to two very large blocks, the lower one being well and truly fastened to the top of the stem with an iron band going down the front of the stem. The purpose of these two blocks, called the stayfall blocks is to lower the whole of the gear down on deck. The wire purchase, the stayfall goes through these blocks and is taken to the windlass , turns are put around the windlass barrel to hold it and, then the gear can be eased down or hoisted up. The anchor chain being slackened up for this purpose. It's all done by man power, and is probably the heaviest job there is to do on a barge, though in actual fact it was done in working days by the skipper and his mate, often a young boy. Though if they were moored near other barges, the other crews would join in to help. Really, it would be a good idea if you could obtain a book that explains the gear to you. You would understand the whole concept of the barge if you did. There is a very good one called ,'A handbook of sailing barges' by F.S.Cooper. It has some very good explanatory illustrations. Fred Cooper was a barge skipper himself and the illustrations were drawn by John Chancellor, who owned a lived on a barge called Viper.
    Hope you understand what I've been trying to explain.

    Cheers, Nerys
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    24 days ago by Nerys ( Admiral)
    Flag
    Sorry, I did not realise you are German. It's very nice that you are taking an interest in our Thames Barges. I admire you for fitting four servos, but I think it is making things too complicated. Four servos are a lot, most of us have one for the steering control and one to control the main sheet and the vang combined. It is very important to control the vang. The vang is a wire that comes from the outer end of the sprit down to deck on both sides and is controlled by a tackle on each side. It's purpose is to make sure that the sprit cannot sag off to leeward, in fact it's like another mainsheet, but at the head of the sail.
    The foresail tack is fastened to the stem just below the two large blocks (which lower all the gear,) The anchor chain goes from the windlass barrel to a roller set in the bulwark and then to the anchor. The foresail is cut so that it does not foul anything.
    Have you, or are you going to fit a weighted keel. They are usually of the bulb and fin type , ( as on most model sailing boats) and weigh about 2.5 Kg. People have tried to sail model barges with just weighted drop down leeboards, but it is not satisfactory. They do not sail well, particularly to windward and have a tendency to capsize.
    Most people leave the leeboards in the up position when sailing, it is not worth trying to do anything else.
    If you look at the AMBO site, there are loads of pictures of model barges and I'm sure that if you study those you will get a better understanding of what it is all about
    Hope all this is of help to you, please do not hesitate to ask anything else, I'm only too pleased to help.

    Cheers, Nerys
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    24 days ago by wwfiets ( Leading Seaman)
    Flag
    Hi, please apologize my englisch that makes it difficult to understand.
    There are 4 RC winches aboard that control circular ropes.
    One for the mainsail, one for the foresail and one for each leeboard.
    Together with the each leeboard, the corresponding running backstay is loosened.
    The foresail is attached to the fore horse and can be handled as you described how a crew member will do.
    I found the facebook group, this gives me a lot of inf, thanks.
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    24 days ago by Nerys ( Admiral)
    Flag
    Yes, I understand about the leeboards being weighted and operated by a winch, but can you operate the winch by radio control. When a barge is sailing, she only has the leeward board down, not both of them, They are raised and lowered as the barge tacks. I presume by samson post you mean the stem. The tack of the foresail goes to the stem, but the sail is cut to go above the windlass and anything else. On a real barge the foresail sheet is a length of chain that goes around the fore horse. It cannot be lengthened or shortened. When tacking, the foresail is held aback by a crew member and when she has come round on the new tack, he lets it go. I have never seen a model where this is replicated. In reality, the helm is put over, the barge comes up into the wind and then pays off on the other tack. What do you mean by a stay that goes from the mast to the middle of the ship that lets the sail swing out. Do you mean the vang, which goes from the end of the sprit down to each side of the barge near the main horse and has tackles on it to let the sprit swing out or be pulled in. I think what you really need is to see some other model barges, look at them and talk to the owners who are only too pleased to talk about their models. Unfortunately, Covid restrictions stop us doing this, but really it's what you need to do. There is a facebook page for model barges, Association of Model Barge Owners, Under normal circumstances, they hold a series of meetings/races mainly in the Eastern part of the UK during the summer and always welcome potential new members. That said, if and when normality returns and the model clubs return to the lakes and ponds, the Thames barge is a very popular model to build and you may find someone in your local club has built one. I am a member of a club in South Wales and there are two of us with barges.

    cheers, Nerys
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    25 days ago by jacko ( Sub-Lieutenant)
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    this is the only shot i have
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    25 days ago by wwfiets ( Leading Seaman)
    Flag
    Yes I'm also anxious to see here on the water.
    The leeboards have lead sheet inside, their weight will pull them down and are lifted by winch. Together with the leeboard going down, the stay that goes from the mast to the middle of the ship is loosening. This helps to let the main sail more swing out.
    The foresail is separately controlled, so she can help to get the bow through the wind when tacking.
    I have a question about fastening the forestay lead. The plan shows that it is attached to the Samson Post on the bow, but this post collides with the anchor chain. After studying lots of photos on the web, I still have no clue how this is done. Also many photos show no Samson Post at all.
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    25 days ago by Nerys ( Admiral)
    Flag
    Interesting that you say that the leeboards are controlled, I take it you mean that they can be raised and lowered by RC. Most people do not bother to do this and leave the leeboards up in place when sailing. Very few real barges were built with a propshaft going through the stern post, only a few in latter days. Most when they had an auxiliary fitted brought the stern tube out on the port side. My model of Nellie has this, as did the real Nellie. I am building an auxiliary barge at the moment and have the shaft coming through the sternpost as you have done. Performance under power will be better. Which sails are you able to control electronically? Most of us only have one control and that is to the mainsail, which of course incorporates the topsail and by joining in the vang has that controlled, all running off the one servo. We do not bother controlling the foresail as in a real barge, it is just able to cross sides on it's horse. I must admit I am not sure about the mizzen in your barge. Being a mulie mizzen, it is a lot bigger than the diminutive sprit mizzen most barges have. There is no point in controlling the tiny area of the sprit mizzen whereas you may find it necessary to be able to control the larger area in your barge. I think if I was building a mulie, I would have a servo on the mizzen. You might find this would help when tacking.
    I'll be interested to see pictures of her on the water and to hear how she sails. If I can be of any help to you please ask, I'll be only too pleased to assist if I possibly can. Apart from the fact that I am working on my sixth model barge. I did skipper the real thing in my younger days.

    Cheers, Nerys
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    1 month ago by wwfiets ( Leading Seaman)
    Flag
    Thanks for your comments; that's why I joined this forum to learn. The ship is ca. 120 cm. As on the plan, I put the prop shaft through the stern post.
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    1 month ago by Nerys ( Admiral)
    Flag
    Looks a nice well built barge but as Rick says, a photo of the whole barge would be appreciated. Have you put the prop shaft through to one side as was normal on the majority of auxiliary barges , or taken it through the stern post?

    Ckeers, Nerys
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    πŸ’¬ Re: Thames Barge Celia Jane
    1 month ago by Newby7 ( Commodore)
    Flag
    Very nice looking barge.How big is she. Would you post a full picture of her.
    Rick
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