- CAPTAIN! CAPTAIN! I'VE JUST HAD AN APOSTROPHE!!
- I THINK YOU MEAN AN EPIPHANY!!
-RIGHT! RIGHT!
I can run the STAYSAIL up the SPRING STAY, which runs between the lower FORE MAST, at the trestle, and the MAIN TOPMAST and carries the STAYSAIL!!! Just retract it backwards up the SPRING STAY
I can run the STAYSAIL up the SPRING STAY, which runs between the lower FORE MAST, at the trestle, and the MAIN TOPMAST and carries the STAYSAIL!!! Just retract it backwards up the SPRING STAY
Hi Ross, I read your answer on the channels and I must say that I too would have difficulty commanding a ship having to operate on six channels.
In addition to being a good builder, you are a skilled pilot, very good.
Why did you make this choice?
I'm interested to know (for my future projects) why so many servos and why so many dedicated channels (five winches and five channels if I understand correctly).
For the winches I figured you wanted to make sure you had the right strength.
For the five channels I didn't imagine an explanation because I didn't find any advantages in controlling the sails individually.
However, I can't wait to see the drawings to understand how you laid out the winches and what the rope system looks like.
Alessandro,
In my 'previous' life (sounds a little Buddhist, doesn't it) operating a skid steer loader (BOBCAT S70 LOADER, if you want to Google it) required left heel control, left toe control, right heel control, right toe control, left arm control, right arm control, strapped into the bouncing machine in a roll cage. ( one of my operator flipped one on its side, they got it back upright on their own and didn't tell me for 2 weeks). To transport this equipment on a truck in a snowstorm, was up 2 ramps 45cm wide, backwards, in the dark about two thirds of the time. I had about 2000 hours on skid steers. I could go on further about 14 hours days in a plow truck, it's boring. Sailing 6 channels is a retirement holiday requiring 2 thumb control and 2 fore finger control. enough of my rant
Alessandro,
In my 'previous' life (sounds a little Buddhist, doesn't it) operating a skid steer loader (BOBCAT S70 LOADER, if you want to Google it) required left heel control, left toe control, right heel control, right toe control, left arm control, right arm control, strapped into the bouncing machine in a roll cage. ( one of my operator flipped one on its side, they got it back upright on their own and didn't tell me for 2 weeks). To transport this equipment on a truck in a snowstorm, was up 2 ramps 45cm wide, backwards, in the dark about two thirds of the time. I had about 2000 hours on skid steers. I could go on further about 14 hours days in a plow truck, it's boring. Sailing 6 channels is a retirement holiday requiring 2 thumb control and 2 fore finger control. enough of my rant
Excellent Ross, it couldn't be clearer than that.
You are an excellent pilot and steering six channels will be a breeze for you. I understand this, I envy you and admire your abilities a lot.
But let's leave Ross the driver for a moment and talk to Ross the builder.
If I (for my next project) wanted to follow your philosophy, what practical advantages would I have in controlling the sails selectively?
I'm asking you because I would like to make improvements and any advice is useful.
Ah, Mr Holmes, you saw through my attempt to misled you with a very thorough answer to only half the question!
The second half
Why?
Firstly, to see if it could be done. Could a 6 channel vessel be put together and operate as hoped? The evidence for and against is still being gathered. More later.
Secondly, 52 years ago I created my own design of schooner, much smaller and simpler. It sailed in breezes I couldn't even feel, a good light wind boat. Total sailing time on that hull might have been 2 hours before life got in the way and it was left behind (ROSEBUD).
Now I have all the time in the world
Thirdly. my design time greatly exceeds my sailing time. So I need lessons and practise. The local model sailing club has been very generous with their time, knowledge, and experience. They have shown me that even the simple 2 channel class racing boats are tuned to performance. Millimeters and grams count in winning races. So, minute changes in configuration, greatly change performance. I have spent most of my career working with and against wind and water, constantly readjusting to adapt. I can now do it as a hobby.
I carry the adjust-adapt philosophy with me to the boat.
The more adjustments that you can control, the better the adaption to the conditions, and the better the performance. I have seen your work displayed here, you do strive for better performance. Your construction performance is art. With more sail controls you can improve your sailing performance. Be it better sailing in light winds (my staysail), faster speed (adjusting the slots between the sails for optimal flow), faster tacking (controlling the jibs), sailing closer to the wind (each sail will have its own optimal setting for maximum force). In the end, it will be how pleased you are with your better performance. You have achieved that with your construction performance. Are you ready to take it to your sailing performance?
Ah, Mr Holmes, you saw through my attempt to misled you with a very thorough answer to only half the question!
The second half
Why?
Firstly, to see if it could be done. Could a 6 channel vessel be put together and operate as hoped? The evidence for and against is still being gathered. More later.
Secondly, 52 years ago I created my own design of schooner, much smaller and simpler. It sailed in breezes I couldn't even feel, a good light wind boat. Total sailing time on that hull might have been 2 hours before life got in the way and it was left behind (ROSEBUD).
Now I have all the time in the world
Thirdly. my design time greatly exceeds my sailing time. So I need lessons and practise. The local model sailing club has been very generous with their time, knowledge, and experience. They have shown me that even the simple 2 channel class racing boats are tuned to performance. Millimeters and grams count in winning races. So, minute changes in configuration, greatly change performance. I have spent most of my career working with and against wind and water, constantly readjusting to adapt. I can now do it as a hobby.
I carry the adjust-adapt philosophy with me to the boat.
The more adjustments that you can control, the better the adaption to the conditions, and the better the performance. I have seen your work displayed here, you do strive for better performance. Your construction performance is art. With more sail controls you can improve your sailing performance. Be it better sailing in light winds (my staysail), faster speed (adjusting the slots between the sails for optimal flow), faster tacking (controlling the jibs), sailing closer to the wind (each sail will have its own optimal setting for maximum force). In the end, it will be how pleased you are with your better performance. You have achieved that with your construction performance. Are you ready to take it to your sailing performance?
Sounds like three good reasons to me, Ross. Especially the first one.
The choice is not irreversible and you can reduce the control to fewer channels (if you deem it appropriate or simply for comparison) very easily.
I await your response on this matter with curiosity.
After the water tests you will be able to tell me (from your direct experience) what the advantages and disadvantages are.
movement of staysail around the foresail
stick on left represents the mainmast
stick on right represents the foremast
stick in centre represents the leach of the foresail
bow to right side
stern to left side
(starboard side view)
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movement of staysail around the foresail
stick on left represents the mainmast
stick on right represents the foremast
stick in centre represents the leach of the foresail
bow to right side
stern to left side
(starboard side view)
First of all, congratulations on your ingenuity and ability to come up with original solutions.
These videos and these discussions make naval modeling not only enjoyable but absolutely exciting for me.
I really like your experimental model, done before applying it to the real RC ship.
I understood everything except this sentence: "stick in center represents the leach of the foresail" because leach is translated in an unlikely way.
However, the video is very explanatory and keeping in mind that the bow faces to the right and the stern to the left, the mechanism is clear.
I only have one doubt left. Won't these current maneuvers (indicated with red arrows) still prevent the foresail from changing tack?
Are you counting on it being very loose when the staysail is close to the mainmast?
Alessandro,
Thank you for your support! By LEACH of the foresail, I was referring to the rear edge of the foresail. The leach of a schooner foresail is almost vertical. It may not be clear from the video, but the line that travels around the rear of the FORESAIL will always be slack, the second line will take the tension. It will then be reversed as the STAYSAIL moves aft of the FORESAIL, to the other side. If I am not explaining properly ask again, I need your challenges.👍
Thank you for your support! By LEACH of the foresail, I was referring to the rear edge of the foresail. The leach of a schooner foresail is almost vertical. It may not be clear from the video, but the line that travels around the rear of the FORESAIL will always be slack, the second line will take the tension. It will then be reversed as the STAYSAIL moves aft of the FORESAIL, to the other side. If I am not explaining properly ask again, I need your challenges.👍
Alessandro
There are actually 4 lines 2 starboard 2 port (at top and bottom)
One pair pull around foresail to port side, the opposite pulls around foresail to starboard side
The line to left and the lower line are the slack line that travel around the foresail. The line to right pulls to foremast
Using your diagram, the slack, dotted line doesn't go from behind the foresail to the mainsail, the slack, dotted line goes from behind the foresail to the luff of the staysail. Pulling on that dotted line will (hopefully) pull the staysail to the rear of the foresail and then back up the the front of the foresail, on the other side.
The staysail remains attached to the mainmast at all times
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There are actually 4 lines 2 starboard 2 port (at top and bottom)
One pair pull around foresail to port side, the opposite pulls around foresail to starboard side
The line to left and the lower line are the slack line that travel around the foresail. The line to right pulls to foremast
Using your diagram, the slack, dotted line doesn't go from behind the foresail to the mainsail, the slack, dotted line goes from behind the foresail to the luff of the staysail. Pulling on that dotted line will (hopefully) pull the staysail to the rear of the foresail and then back up the the front of the foresail, on the other side.
The staysail remains attached to the mainmast at all times
Using a copy of the JIBS WINCH, one side will pay out 76 cm of line, while the other side takes up 76 cm of line. To change side, reverse motor
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Yes Alessandro, you are correct
The JIBS WINCH is doing a similar job to the STAYSAIL WINCH. PORT & STARBOARD lines up and over the JIB TOPSAIL STAY & the JIB STAY, 4 lines
PORT JIB TOPSAIL
STARBOARD JIB TOPSAIL
PORT JIB
STARBOARD JIB
So the STAYSAIL WINCH can be a copy of the JIBS WINCH
The 4 servo winch control is now a 5 servo winch control, with encouragement from Alessandro
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In addition to being a good builder, you are a skilled pilot, very good.
Why did you make this choice?
I'm interested to know (for my future projects) why so many servos and why so many dedicated channels (five winches and five channels if I understand correctly).
For the winches I figured you wanted to make sure you had the right strength.
For the five channels I didn't imagine an explanation because I didn't find any advantages in controlling the sails individually.
However, I can't wait to see the drawings to understand how you laid out the winches and what the rope system looks like.